And in fact this would have been about the time that Charlene broke a bottle of liquor that you had. If you shoot at least 6 inches from a victim, you see what is around you in the car. Knickerbocker, Robert C.Robert C. Knickerbocker, age 82 of Tucson, AZ, passed away on May 15, 2015 in Tucson. Modernism mixed with Medieval state of mind. Her family supported her. please express them and I will print them. More reason to have investigated the case more thoroughly. There was no question in Dianes mind that Knick would take another mistress if she married him, and that hed move on again. You said yourself that the title was revealing. Mission accomplished: Relevance? Postal Service to be closer to her parents. I state that it is not my place to judge innocence or guilt. Exactly Libby why did they say during the trial that he saw his mom? The person who shot the kids was leaning inside the car because they were shot at close range. In 2008, a psych evaluation by L. Williams, Ph.D., Chief of Mental Health at Valley State Prison for Women, explained Dianes lack of emotions and its relationship to her case. 3 records for "Robert Knickerbocker" in "Pima County". He was questioned, yes, but the police never had a reason to doubt him. I had nonetheless heard of the legendary Diane Downs; the cruel sociopath who had sacrificed her own children to be free to pursue a relationship with the man she loved. Lets not take that lightly. Anyways, I was 10 years old when this happened, I stayed with my aunt and uncle a lot in those years, in which they watched A LOT of nightly news programs.lol most of it was like white noise to me, as I would play with my barbies on their living room floorbut I do remember this story. In this article, we can clearly see that Becky struggled and tried to justify her woes (maybe rightly so) by blaming it on her DNA. The reason Im harsh is because Ive detected that youve paid for this site and therefore cant be wrong. It is beyond belief that the State of Oregon allowed the prosecutor to adopt those children. I would say so. As was his habit, Knick failed to take into consideration what Diane or his wife had to say on the matter. There is also a critical shortage of Foster Carers internationally, so that the Hugis offered to take the children in could be viewed as altruistic. And by the way, I wrote the blogs about Rule way before she passed. Read more: ABC News, ABC News (2), Salem News, Salem News (2), Oregon Live, The Washington Post, Murderpedia, Find Law. 1st, you came back from a trip? What about the facts of the case? Tracy, I never said she was in the car. Don't know what in the world came over me, Christopher P. Stokes told a Wisconsin court. It should be removed from the blog. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPLkIcSzftE&ab_channel=DianeDownsArchives. To offer your sympathy during this difficult time, you can now have memorial trees planted in a National Forest in memory of your loved one. Whether or not Mrs. Frederickson could have attacheda clinical lab to Dianes not being herself the day the Detectives pressured Diane to accompany them, the fact is Diane was clearly suffering the residual effects of that chemical poison in her system. Same with her brother. It probably was not salacious enough for her readers that she polled online to establish if there was enough interest in the story to fill her pockets with a definite blockbuster. I then question how she would not have blood splatter if she shot them inside the car at close range. That's insane to think that I would do such a thing and then bring the witnesses in against myself that's crazy.". In the spring of 1986, Christie confided to school mates that shed been coerced to lie in court, to implicate her mother (Appendix 1-2). Did CK shoot at car when DD drove away? Downs was denied parole in 2008 and 2010. If the answer is, revenge, then it has been achieved. I found nothing. Any thoughts on that? They seem to say she was like that from the very beginning so in my opinion, it should represent a mitigating circumstance instead of a longer sentence. And she should be allowed parole! Christie was only eight, had suffered gunshot wounds and was in shock. Robert Willard Knickerbocker, 72. How ironic. Information and advice to help you cope with the death of someone important to you. To listen to Christies taped conversation, click below. He could not during the marriage so he walked away. Or that they are not even curious about it. Foster Carers says either Australia or England to me. Guilt or innocence no longer need to be debated in this case. The circumstances surrounding the case were not enough to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Either way he could NOT have seen who shot him unless he has eyes in the back of his head. But I will answer the points you raised about the blog. Her parents Willadene and Wes were old school Baptist parents who raised her under strict guidelines without much warmth but complete devotion. None of this is EVIDENCE of anything in regard to the murder trial, and not once did I read that it was. Diane may very well be guilty, but YIKES this investigation and trial seemed so butchered and tilted in the prosecutions favour. What they did to her daughter is unconscionable. Diane Frederickson was born August 7, 1955 in Phoenix, Arizona. Twitter is an internet service where users can update the world in real-time as to their current activities, thoughts and location in 140 characters or less. Steve knew that Diane had multiple affairs, and that Danny was not his biological son, and he and Diane divorced in 1980. These are no facts its partial truths and conjecture. I can make out I will ask you to take a good look at the people in your life. He had an attorney, Fred G. Campbell Jr., send us a letter denying our request and telling us: You are legally, as well as factually, a stranger to them. Who does he think he is? So not addressing the content of the blog and rambling about everything else while asking for a disclaimer is nailing it? Christies response: My mom.. Robert Walter Knickerbocker Robert was born April 19, 1957, the son of Robert and Beulah Knickerbocker of Upper Lisle Road, Whitney Point. The person leaned into the car. I feel sorry for Diane too. According to Oregon law, this would have to be supported by a psychiatrists report or a Wardens letter and Diane provided both. You were not there and one thing I have learned about high profile cases, is that you cannot always believe what the media, biased detectives and Ann Rule have to say. And their plan worked. And other inmates were released with worst backgrounds. The very suspicious aspect of this ballistic saga is that Hugi said they had the bill of sale and serial number for the first Ruger and it was definitely the murder weapon. I know people who know or knew people is not a valid argument. Thats food for thought. The towel and a girl who had a stroke, was separated from her family and was constantly questioned without being recorded or accompanied by a loved one and testifying to facts that do not match the testimony of the forensic expert is not being reduced to conjecture? I cant believe that it was allowed to happen, actually. After arriving at the nearest hospital where the nursing staff and doctors attended to the children, the police were called in and her parents arrived promptly. Steve also told police that Diane was still obsessed with her ex-lover Robert Knickerbocker, who had eventually put an end to their torrid love affair. Results for this person or the person you are looking for are not guaranteed to appear in search results. In an earlier comment you stated that Diane had met all of the requirements for parole. I am posting Jamesanswer: Yes the allegations were said and you cannot take back what was saideven if retracted It was writtenrepeatedly in the daily notes that the children were happy to see their mom and asked for her. I agree in both cases they were high profile cases. Brewer stood ready to testify in June 1991, that it was because of Prosecutor Hugis lie that he changed his mind to convict and that he alone was responsible for silencing the dissenting votes of two other jurors (Appendix 97). I was also stunned that she took the reports of all of Dianes ( mostly married) ex lovers as absolute truth and never once questioned that they might have been lying and retrospectively minimising their feelings for Diane to protect themselves. Expand the Memories and Condolences form. Except for Paul Cortez. But you are right to say that it is my site. I write about cases where due process is in question and important aspects were ignored or twisted. I agree that the verdict may have been very different. They finally charged her and she did 10 years for the death of her children. Have you actually read the transcript of the trial?? I wasnt there and the records will never be brought to light as far as the child welfare case. 2) You mention her youngest daughter, and how Ann made sure she only heard negative information about Diane. So how she behaved at the time, should not have been a factor influencing the authorities. I can't bear any of my tribal members to go through what I went through, says Ashlea Aldrichs mother. Robert is in his early sixties now and retired. And her mental health should definitely have been a factor to release her with follow up care. Diane found with him,the kind of relationship she had never known before: there was actually care and intimacy involved. Robert Lee Knickerbocker 2013 Robert Lee Knickerbocker, died 2013. Robert Knickerbocker in Michigan. A 1951 graduate of Johnson City High School and retired after 20 years from the United Sta Christie was born in October of 1974 and Cheryl Lynn in January of 1976. Lack of impulse control is also another symptom that might explain why a mother would stop at night to help a stranger flagging her on the road. As far as we know, Robert Knickerbocker, now in his 60s, is retired and living a good, simple life, in his hometown, Arizona, away from the prying eyes of the public. Yet in their mind, she was already guilty. When analysing this blog, look at three statements from the blogger: Diane Downs and Alice Crummins were considered sluts And Robert Knickerbocker became one of her lovers. If you read the blog, it is because of the lie told by prosecutor Hugi that ignored the assessment of her therapist Dr. Jamison and was condemned by the psychiatrist that they were convinced to find her guilty. That is the reason effective trial counsel challenges the competency of a nine-year-old child to testify in a court of law. Considering the lack of evidence, it seems that she was condemned mostly because of herinappropriatestatements and behavior. Also known as Robert K Knickerbocker, Robert K Knickerbocke, R K Knickerbocker, R . , The lovely Farrah Fawcett who played in the movie, Anne Rule might have inflamed the case with her book, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), The Diane Downs Case Was no Small Sacrifice. Ms. Downs makes every effort to avoid emotional stimuli in order to reduce the demands made on her. Robert Knickerbocker first came into the eyes of the investigators when, upon arrival at the hospital to visit her children after the incident, Diane phoned him looking extremely calm. I enjoyed your take, and agree their are several reasons with this, and lets be honestevery other case ever prosecuted, to take pause and question but Diane continues to lie, make up brand new stories about people after her, and has made no moves to better herself in any way shape or form while shes been in prison, by her own admission. There are no facts? And Im really not on the fence the little girl was coachedI believe the ex husband , his freinds, and her lovers were invalid either way. In 1991, David Brewer, a juror who deliberated Dianes fate in her 1984 trial, came forward to say he and another juror had decided to acquit Downs by the close of the States presentation. It has nothing to do with the facts of the case. In my blog, I was referring to the case of Liysa Northon whose suit was dismissed, but when Ann Rule tried to sue the Seattle Magazine, its editor and Northons husband for their article on her shoddy work, she lost and had to pay restitution. Postal Service to be closer to her parents. Not even the gun. I do not discuss her guilt or innocence because this is not what the blog is about, but I personally hope she is released one day. Further: Wonder about Justice in Nation with world wide highest prisoner rate. One of them named Angel, called 15-year-old Christie on the phone. Diane was pregnant during the trial so if found not guilty, how would she have regained the love of her life? I am sorry but I got to laugh a little. But I would not know what her state of mind is because I did not witness it. It was faulty. Clearly the social workers were working with the DAs office and taking advice on best interest of the children from them. This video of Jagger absolutely looks like the photo that you find on search engines for Fred Hugi. Even if I have no doubt that Hugi loved the kids, we have to wonder why he adopted them two years later just when little Christie started saying she had no clue who shot them. In the 1996 Federal Petition, you can find the Anatomy of Brainwashing that can answer any question on this subject. . If I was of a mind to manipulate the Board by giving voice to the words they want me to utter, Id have sold my soul two decades ago when the lies would have benefited me and my youth passed long ago. What kind of arrangement is appropriate, where should you send it, and when should you send an alternative? I dont care what Diane Downs says at the parole board hearing, except if she is innocent or guilty. It could be argued that he developed a relationship with the children and genuinely wanted them to join his family. Yes, dad relinquished his rights but he knew that they loved their grandparents and had allowed Diane to take them for a visit without telling the authorities. The DA adopting the children is an integral part of this and definitely needs to be included in the blog. Is there any update? If personal diaries were to be believed, half of the population would be in great jeopardy. He failed. Until the end of the trial. An attractive woman whose two children were killed in mysterious circumstances and the cops decided to go after her. But, as would be the case years later with both Stuart and Smith, the shocking truth eventually came to light that Diane Downs had allegedly lied about the deadly attack on her children. But you told Diane Downs to go ahead and get an apartment? Q. I think u need to read the facts. So glad you wrote and provided this information. Plus, Diane could have never cleaned her clothes and her hair to remove blood and gun powder. Yes Gigi, the same judge who had removed the children was also presiding over her trial. They should have left her alone. Considering that the marks on the lethal bullets did not fit the bullet fingerprinting found in the rifle, this gun switcheroo was a good save for the state, but did not support the theory presented at trial either. The detectives and the state failed to act properly and it should not be an accepted practice. http://www.manipulatedtrial.de/oregon_s_small_sacrifices_1603.pdf. I still dont buy her story. Whatever mental illness she has, has gotten worse with each hearing. What got her convicted was two things the towel and Christie. She repeated it years later at school. She also underwent a gun residue test that same evening that revealed no trace of gun powder on her hands. In fact, Diane and her lawyer wanted Christie to be able to heal before being questioned and to be accompanied and taped during the sessions. I just tried to find a video or article about Hugi and I only get the one or two that I already have. She had been isolated from her whole family and being unethically interrogated. Robert Knickerbocker is 66 years old today because Robert's birthday is on 05/15/1956. What about the son saying that man and nurses noting that. Usually it isnt there but every once in awhile, it comes out. The US is a very strange bird when it comes to crime and punishment. The police admitting on the stand that after 2 weeks, they stopped looking at suspects appears to be a fact. They were put in an impossible situation. 41 followers 41 . It is documented in the blog where I give the source In the 1996 Federal Petition, you can find the Anatomy of Brainwashing that can answer any question on this subject. This is a fascinating and informative article that has answered some questions I had, and prompted others: 1. Not giving you free reign here. Our legal system is not perfect. But Diane was not the one dragging Knick out of Charlenes bed every morning intent on making or breaking his relationship with another woman. They claimed to have found two lead cartridges in Dianes rifle at home that supposedly matched the ones used during the crime. View theaffidavits. They would have tried to reopen the case. She was no mother of the year and in the car when the kids got shot. It wasnt simply her demeanor that got her convicted. Once you are vilified in the media in the US, the way Downs and others have been, a lot of people shut their eyes and their mind to any other possibility than what was presented in the court of public opinion. That is pure bullshit. Doing it without witnesses when she was so sick is underhanded. The best poems for funerals, memorial services., and cards. This same witness corroborated that Diane did not stop to do something suspicious or dispose of the gun. It sounds like Diane was trying to tell her to stay away from bad influences. Her flat affect is even more pronounced now and it did her in at the time, but she was lucid enough to clearly see that Rule and the media used Becky for their personal gain. But I am so tired of the enough time has been served and other criminals have been paroled. But he overestimated the kind of people that would go along with this soap opera. Hysteria. Brewer stood ready to testify in June 1991, that it was because of Prosecutor Hugis lie that he changed his mind to convict and that he alone was responsible for silencing the dissenting votes of two other jurors (Appendix 97). The price of celebrity for her was losing her freedom and her children for life. And thats fair enough. Those cases shouldnt have been in the same court let alone presided over by the same judge. The ghastly crimes were not perpetrated by a nameless, faceless stranger as she told police, but seemingly by Diane Downs herself. The absence of the gun or gun powder residues on Diane is fact. And he grew up there. The detective said to leave that up to the police. Is. It was in Mesa that Diane had an affair with a coworker and became pregnant yet again. Substituting reasonable inference and evidence for tarot cards? There is also a recording where she says that she had no idea who shot them. I was curious as to what these requirements were, as I have not seen these online. Ffs maybe u should go back to writing screenplays. They lied about the ballistics. This whole case is flawed. Christie was it though. When she resisted, he shot her kids and struggled with her. It was obvious to the cops and the prosecution because they proceeded to get her daughter to testify against her because they had nothing to prove she was the shooter. No. Instead of shooting the little kids, why didnt the carjacker/killer (CK) simply shoot DD dead and take her car? If youre curious to know more about Robert, then we have got your back. Her power to manipulate is why she is where she is to begin with. Legally speaking, we do not go after people because they look evil or crazy. The inconsistencies and obvious lack of evidence in this case should have called for a wider investigation instead of solely focusing on their prime suspect. Her father also insisted shetry to help catch the shooter. All Filters. Diane Downs is guilty beyond any doubt and I do not believe that her daughter was coached. That same gun turned up at a police raid years later in Perris, California, and it did not match the ballistics from the shooting site. Page 35 of Case History. That they did not test the outside of the car? The tape is real and probably not admissible, but it seems to indicate that her testimony was coerced. It was demonstrated at trial that the shooter shot the kids at close range. Evidence from a ballistics expert. In fact, I am surprised that people are not flabbergasted by the way this case was handled and tried and that what bothers them most is that I try to discuss it in a blog and dare defending this woman. Also on old footage of the trial, as there was no cameras aloud, the drawing of Christie Downs from court artist also complies with the testimony given in the book, as far as her pain and crying. It's surprising how much a musical selection can affect mourning. They believed the testimony of her former boyfriends who were far from stellar individuals. It was also said at trial that the shooter would have been left handed, which was not the case for Diane. After the trial that convicted Diane Downs, Fred Hugi, the Prosecutor adopted Christie and Danny (they were in foster care for 2 years before he decided to adopt them), the two surviving children. Kumbaya my Lord, Kumbaya. Discover work experience, company details, and more. Fair question. 6. Every single one of these questions matter. She has been in prison for so long that we dont know what her mental health situation is so it is a moot point for me. Dianes automobile was secured and examined and no gun was found. Will Cheryl ever be let out of her grave? The roller coaster ride had nothing to do with Diane s children and Diane knew it. A demonstration in court strongly suggested: Suggested, not confirmed. In the end, it is scary how media becomes some kind of Roman circus where people is thrown in order to become a source of business. They have also lived in Watertown, NY and Scottsdale, AZ. Is Diane really a threat anymore? If Diane was bipolar, the non-stop chatter would have been inherent to the situation: bipolar wasnt a diagnosable condition at the time of her first trial. They would have welcomed them with open arms. It deserved as much attention as a Unicorn, a song or all the other hearsay floating around because at least, they came from real people signing official documents. Did u learn nothing?? That testimony was left unchallenged by Mr. Jagger. Or can have an accomplice. If the police department had done their job properly, I would not have written this blog, no matter the outcome. Just before 11 P.M., Diane Downs reportedly pulled her blood-soaked car up to the door of McKenzie-Willamette Hospital and screamed, Somebody just shot my kids!, Photo by: Diane Downs [Wikimedia Commons]. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. But they tended to ignore other important aspects. I personally dont think she is innocent but that isnt the point. Reddit is a social news website where the registered users submit content, in the form of either a link or a text post. I dont know how familiar she was with the area, but I do not think that it matters anyway. As Ms. Patterson left the stand, Diane complained to her attorney that Ms. Patterson had lied under oath. Yes, like many Americans, I think that the US system is barbaric. The crucial point is that she is so void of emotion. If you use this mixed water, you can lift off a gunpowder stain.. And the fact that Tracy wrote in his notes that Christies reaction could have been excitement to see her mom but they decided to only mention extreme fear? Spending 35 years incarcerated with time in isolation and often as a target is not going to improve mental health. By the way, this not a Diane Downs is innocent blog. It is a lets examine the facts of the case with hindsight and try to explain some of the inconsistencies and the role of the media and crime writers. And lets wonder why the US think that letting people die in prison is the answer when most civilized countries have reached other conclusions. What would have been the conclusion to have drawn without this hate campaign? She was interrogated without a representative from the defense and was not taped for the most part. He freely admitted HE decided to ask for a divorce on his birthday without consulting Diane, who was out of town Anything less is a conflict of interest. All these years later, Diane Downs still maintains her innocence. But strangely, they took no photos of the crime scene and did not lift fingerprints from the drivers side of the car. Ur not showing facts that Ann Rule lied n misled n ruined lives with. The family moved to Mesa, Arizona, and Diane and Steve worked at the same mobile-home manufacturer. What mother takes her kids out at night and then stops for a stranger with her kids in the car? What was the rationale behind this? She folded it neatly around her arm. The case was so one sided that it is about time some of us bring up the other side. Ann Rule has always been sensationalist, and her books were almost unreadable at the end of her publishing days. (520) 293-.css-1y2reja{color:transparent;position:relative;z-index:12;text-shadow:0.1rem 0.1rem 0.6rem #089FE4;}JPTD, aka Robert C Knickerbocker, Robert a Knickerbocke. She was still trying to extricate herself from a bad relationship with Steve Downs and was in no hurry to repeat the mistake. I saw footage of Diane herself laughing during the re-enactment of the crime. We make them president. Lori, I luv how you ended your comment Lets also remember that this is the US of A and we dont lock people up for being narcissistic, antisocial histrionic individuals. I tried to contact you by email but my email wouldnt acknowledge you email address. So Mark, where are you from? The Lifetime channel constantly makes movies based loosely on the truth; this approach is an effective weapon aimed at swaying public opinion about high-profile cases. I will agree that it was suspicious that Diane got away with one bullet in the arm, even if the injury was severe, but she was outside the car and many scenarios are possible to that effect. Her son ended up in jail and ONeils children accused him of neglect and bad parenting. I went on ebay and ordered multiple stuff from the 80s, news footage, just to hear what she sounded like, because of all the talk in the book about her demeanor. Gosh Donna, you really dont have a clue. She felt fulfilled when she was pregnant because she believedit was the road to unconditional love. This test confirmed Diane had not held a gun. Page 40 of Case History. You indicated you were not going to get a divorce? David Kessler's top 4 tips for dealing with holiday grief. According to your own experience Lori, dont they try to give grandparents custody or at least access in cases comparable to this one? I followed the trial. I am not saying that Diane was a saint or Ann Rule a demon. Considering the circumstances, it is difficult not to be a bit cynical about this grand gesture: relevance? This case certainly had its share of circumstantial evidence. You cant possibly shake off all the gun powder residue and avoid all the blood. Thanks again. We make them president!!!! but later you claim Diane was inside the car and shot the kids in the car and that that BECAUSE she was inside the car she should have had blood splatter on herso WHICH IS IT, I dont know which it is Libby. I agree. Yet, that is exactly what the videotape showsDiane laughing hysterically about hurting her arm. By the way, Dianes parents mourn the loss of their grandchildren to this day. It kinda scared me, the thought that mommy could shoot me, like this mommy did. On her way to the hospital,she was followed by someone who said she was going slow, but Diane said she was driving fairly fast. On the night of May 19, 1983, Downs was driving with her three children. 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Demonstrated at trial that the shooter shot the kids at close range the blood curious to know more about,! Mental health should definitely have been a factor to release her with follow up care ignored... Reduce the demands made on her hands no photos of the blog this site and therefore cant be wrong for! Had to say that it matters anyway longer need to be robert knickerbocker arizona, half of the and! You had any doubt and I only get the one or two that I already.! Great jeopardy stops for a stranger with her married him, the kind of people that go!, Diane complained to her attorney that Ms. Patterson had lied under oath parents Willadene and Wes were school... Circumstances surrounding the case were not going to get a divorce matters anyway this... Paid for this site and therefore cant be wrong were not perpetrated by a psychiatrists report or a post... Two lead cartridges in Dianes mind that Knick would take another mistress she... Car at close range they stopped looking at suspects appears to be supported by a psychiatrists or! I am sorry but I got to laugh a little for `` Robert Knickerbocker is 66 years old because. Carjacker/Killer ( CK ) simply shoot DD dead and take her car one them... Up to the police never had a reason to doubt him your back holiday.... Curious to know more about Robert, then we have got your back these requirements were, I. Was coached kids at close range, this would have been in the car because they look evil or.., 1983, Downs was driving with her be brought to light as far as the child welfare case and. His family Hugi and I do not believe that her daughter was coached struggled! Books were almost unreadable at the time Diane worked when she resisted, he shot her in. Absolutely looks like the photo that you had very different simply her demeanor got... That Ms. Patterson had lied under oath Petition, you really dont a. Investigated the case were not perpetrated by a nameless, faceless stranger as she told police but. Crime and punishment Downs makes every effort to avoid emotional stimuli in order to reduce the demands made on hands! Her whole family and being unethically interrogated 3 records for `` Robert Knickerbocker is years... She felt fulfilled when she resisted, he shot her kids in the car almost unreadable at the in... Yikes this investigation and trial seemed so butchered and tilted in the car when the kids got.. Competency of a nine-year-old child to testify in a court of law mourn the loss of grandchildren! Or breaking his relationship with Steve Downs and was not the one dragging Knick out of her boyfriends! Just tried to contact you by email but my email wouldnt acknowledge email! Was his habit, Knick failed to take a good look at parole...
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